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« Reply #15 on: June 02, 2017, 10:39:28 AM »

That is even worse, it's abusing people
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« Reply #16 on: June 02, 2017, 10:59:04 AM »

That is even worse, it's abusing people

What about child ***ists? Or people who have killed children?
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« Reply #17 on: June 02, 2017, 11:07:34 AM »

That isn't a part of the discussion, we may discuss that somewhere else

Someone mentioned earlier on the usage of criminals in product testing.
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« Reply #18 on: June 02, 2017, 11:11:40 AM »

Your point is...?

Someone complained that it would be abusing people.

I commented on that, asking if it would be okay on child ***ists or murderers of children.
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« Reply #19 on: June 02, 2017, 11:20:49 AM »

Just because someone is a criminal does not mean that they have lost their human rights.
if that was true there wouldn't be death sentences
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« Reply #20 on: June 02, 2017, 01:07:27 PM »

If they learn to control how many or which types of animals, it might be okay. I think that animals such as rats or mice are fine, but others such as rabbits, hamsters, dogs, cats, etc. is a bit too much.

How is a mouse different from a dog and how is a dog different from a human?
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« Reply #21 on: June 02, 2017, 01:12:12 PM »

I think we should just remove these random harmful tests.

If it is for a new medication then they should get willing humans to be tested on it.

But we do not need to administrate electrical shocks to mice just to see if they will become scared of electricity or anything like that
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« Reply #22 on: June 02, 2017, 02:26:10 PM »

why not
we could learn more about how fears are developed, that's pretty important
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« Reply #23 on: June 02, 2017, 02:32:13 PM »

How is a mouse different from a dog and how is a dog different from a human?
Very.
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« Reply #24 on: June 02, 2017, 02:53:05 PM »

But how can we test them then ?
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« Reply #25 on: June 02, 2017, 04:09:07 PM »

why not
we could learn more about how fears are developed, that's pretty important

But we would treat living and breathing things as just objects. If you want to learn how fears develop then don't use poor things that deserve a free home.

Roles in society
Mice don't do much except eat food and be eaten
Dogs have much more intelligence, and have been known to be friendly to other animals, and helpful
Humans have created civilization and have invented things to improve life
There is a huge difference

And all three feel pain, and should not be subjected to it for the cruel needs of scientists.
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« Reply #26 on: June 02, 2017, 04:10:46 PM »

But how can we test them then ?

1 - we stop the random atrocity experiments that have zero scientifically merit for any other reason than "hey what happens if we *insert painful thing for animals*.

2 - we use consenting humans that are paid to test this stuff, and obviously we would not perform experiments hat are extremely dangerous on them.
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« Reply #27 on: June 02, 2017, 04:14:40 PM »

Or we could use what Ianiant, Ixora and Robin suggested and use criminals that have done heinous acts for experiments.

Of course they would not be put into experiments that are really dangerous like radioactivity.
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« Reply #28 on: June 02, 2017, 04:22:14 PM »

how do we test things like how the brain matures
you can't get infants and toddlers to say yes
1 - we stop the random atrocity experiments that have zero scientifically merit for any other reason than "hey what happens if we *insert painful thing for animals*.
but there isn't zero scientific merit
But we would treat living and breathing things as just objects. If you want to learn how fears develop then don't use poor things that deserve a free home.
what else would we use
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« Reply #29 on: June 02, 2017, 04:24:48 PM »

And all three feel pain, and should not be subjected to it for the cruel needs of scientists.
By that logic no one would test anything, who cares if mice feel pain as long as the testing could be helpful
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