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« Reply #1605 on: August 09, 2020, 08:37:59 PM »

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8600105/Almost-100-people-catch-COVID-19-one-infected-man-went-church-Ohio.html

...This is why in-person service is a bad idea. Exasperated
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« Reply #1606 on: August 09, 2020, 08:49:44 PM »

 Bored
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« Reply #1607 on: August 09, 2020, 11:16:03 PM »

Brother E: I don't believe that what so ever. It was probably because everyone went to Walmart. More people have a chance being infected there instead of a church.  Besides,  how do they even know he started the spread? What kind of guess is that?
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« Reply #1608 on: August 09, 2020, 11:36:55 PM »

Brother E: I don't believe that what so ever. It was probably because everyone went to Walmart. More people have a chance being infected there instead of a church.  Besides,  how do they even know he started the spread? What kind of guess is that?
It's because they thought about it logically, and how a single community that only comes together for church all got COVID in a matter of weeks. There is no way all these churchgoers coincidentally got the virus at the same time. The man was identified and everything too. I'm not sure how this can be refuted by you?

No offense, but also throwing Walmart into the argument seems a bit like a scapegoat. All of them got the virus from the same grocery store all in the same time-span of two weeks? That is nonsense.
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« Reply #1609 on: August 09, 2020, 11:39:56 PM »

It's because they thought about it logically, and how a single community that only comes together for church all got COVID in a matter of weeks. There is no way all these churchgoers coincidentally got the virus at the same time. The man was identified and everything too. I'm not sure how this can be refuted by you?

No offense, but also throwing Walmart into the argument seems a bit like a scapegoat. All of them got the virus from the same grocery store all in the same time-span of two weeks? That is nonsense.
Brother E: It didn't say church goers got it, it said 100 people in the community got it. That means people who don't go to church probably got it as well. So they could have gotten it from anyone, just not the church.
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« Reply #1610 on: August 10, 2020, 12:08:16 AM »

Brother E: It didn't say church goers got it, it said 100 people in the community got it. That means people who don't go to church probably got it as well. So they could have gotten it from anyone, just not the church.
You're getting community itself confused with community spread. The man attended a church service whilst infected with COVID, and while there, potentially coming into contact with dozens of people (depending on how involved with the church he is), and through these interactions, enabled community spread (Spreading the virus/sicknesses in a setting where the newly-infected have had no other way of being handed the illness, all happening in their own area/city, or in this case, their church). He was also dubbed a 'super spreader,' who just made a lasting impact on the cases around where he lives, because, with so many people he infected, those people he gave the virus to will now most likely give the virus to others as well, people not within their church's circle. I'd also like to touch onto your point that suggests "More people have a chance being infected at [Walmart] instead of a church." Sure, I'm sure Walmart, sadly, has helped transmit the disease many times before, but, you, as devout as you are, do you not know what the nature of church really feels like? The many times I've went,  everyone feels close together, talking up close to one-another, sitting right next to each other in the pews while the pastor talks the holy word... One of the bigger aspects to church is interacting with your neighbors and community, so how does that mean these places are just absent from spreading the virus? They aren't. Over this pandemic there's been multiple cases of spread through church services, including some from mega-churches, with well over hundreds of goers for their events. As well, so many elderly people attend service, the population most likely to succumb to the virus. I understand that you, as a Christian, feel that churches having these problems is strange and you might have some sort of denial in actually accepting them as virus hot spots, but the setting of churches as a whole are so perfectly aligned for spreading COVID that it's sadly unreal. I don't know if you still attend church in-person or not right now, but if you do, then I really hope you guys don't catch it, because it's a danger, and service is an easy place for you to catch it, or have a wide spreading impact on a church community. Stay safe.
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« Reply #1611 on: August 10, 2020, 07:28:34 AM »

You're getting community itself confused with community spread. The man attended a church service whilst infected with COVID, and while there, potentially coming into contact with dozens of people (depending on how involved with the church he is), and through these interactions, enabled community spread (Spreading the virus/sicknesses in a setting where the newly-infected have had no other way of being handed the illness, all happening in their own area/city, or in this case, their church). He was also dubbed a 'super spreader,' who just made a lasting impact on the cases around where he lives, because, with so many people he infected, those people he gave the virus to will now most likely give the virus to others as well, people not within their church's circle. I'd also like to touch onto your point that suggests "More people have a chance being infected at [Walmart] instead of a church." Sure, I'm sure Walmart, sadly, has helped transmit the disease many times before, but, you, as devout as you are, do you not know what the nature of church really feels like? The many times I've went,  everyone feels close together, talking up close to one-another, sitting right next to each other in the pews while the pastor talks the holy word... One of the bigger aspects to church is interacting with your neighbors and community, so how does that mean these places are just absent from spreading the virus? They aren't. Over this pandemic there's been multiple cases of spread through church services, including some from mega-churches, with well over hundreds of goers for their events. As well, so many elderly people attend service, the population most likely to succumb to the virus. I understand that you, as a Christian, feel that churches having these problems is strange and you might have some sort of denial in actually accepting them as virus hot spots, but the setting of churches as a whole are so perfectly aligned for spreading COVID that it's sadly unreal. I don't know if you still attend church in-person or not right now, but if you do, then I really hope you guys don't catch it, because it's a danger, and service is an easy place for you to catch it, or have a wide spreading impact on a church community. Stay safe.
Brother E: I understand in some senses what you are getting at, but I still think they are grasping at straws.

And yes, me and a lot of Christians believe they are shutting churches down for no reason.  Like I said,  they let everyone go to stores and theme parks, and even let dentists work your mouth, but when it's a church,  they are all trying to shut them down. Yes, churches may be hotspots,  but so are stores and theme parks. If you aren't going to shut them down,  don't let the churches get shut down. Because where I live, even though they say wear a mask, people go into stores,  sometimes ourselves, without masks and don't even get in trouble.
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« Reply #1612 on: August 10, 2020, 02:46:56 PM »

Brother E: I don't believe that what so ever. It was probably because everyone went to Walmart. More people have a chance being infected there instead of a church.  Besides,  how do they even know he started the spread? What kind of guess is that?
Churches are nonessential businesses, whereas grocery stores are essential businesses. Furthermore, based on the nature of church services you are way more likely to catch the virus at church than at the store.
When you go to the store you go in, get what you need, pay, and leave. At the store there is often no human interaction, or very little. In contrast, when you go to church you will sit in a crowded area where social distancing is nearly impossible, and you stay at a church much longer then you would the grocery store. If you go to church during the pandemic good luck, not catching the virus.
During the pandemic churches should just close down, they are nonessential businesses after all. Alternatives to attending church which don't involve the risk of infecting others include watching church services on TV, or attending online church services.
While stores are essential, and people are much less likely to get the virus at the store, I still recommend minimizing your visits to the store during the pandemic, and making use of services such as online shopping (Amazon is a better place to shop than Walmart, during times of crisis), grocery delivery, and curbside grocery pickup when possible.
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« Reply #1613 on: August 10, 2020, 04:04:53 PM »

Churches are nonessential businesses, whereas grocery stores are essential businesses. Furthermore, based on the nature of church services you are way more likely to catch the virus at church than at the store.
When you go to the store you go in, get what you need, pay, and leave. At the store there is often no human interaction, or very little. In contrast, when you go to church you will sit in a crowded area where social distancing is nearly impossible, and you stay at a church much longer then you would the grocery store. If you go to church during the pandemic good luck, not catching the virus.
During the pandemic churches should just close down, they are nonessential businesses after all. Alternatives to attending church which don't involve the risk of infecting others include watching church services on TV, or attending online church services.
While stores are essential, and people are much less likely to get the virus at the store, I still recommend minimizing your visits to the store during the pandemic, and making use of services such as online shopping (Amazon is a better place to shop than Walmart, during times of crisis), grocery delivery, and curbside grocery pickup when possible.
Brother E: Well, the same happens in the church in a sense.  You walk in, greet people, have the service,  and leave. Some people spend hours longer in theme parks and stores than they do in services.
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« Reply #1614 on: August 10, 2020, 04:08:10 PM »

I mean your belief just becomes bigger, what else?
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« Reply #1615 on: August 10, 2020, 04:09:47 PM »

Brother E: Well, the same happens in the church in a sense.  You walk in, greet people, have the service,  and leave. Some people spend hours longer in theme parks and stores than they do in services.
Who actually greets people in a store?
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« Reply #1616 on: August 10, 2020, 06:16:23 PM »

Brother E: Well, the same happens in the church in a sense.  You walk in, greet people, have the service,  and leave. Some people spend hours longer in theme parks and stores than they do in services.
Ummm, no. Sometimes, you talk or sing as a congregation, which is very dangerous for people.
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« Reply #1617 on: August 10, 2020, 07:39:52 PM »

Brother E: Fine, we'll agree to disagree. I and many other people who go to church believe that it's the same or worse in stores and theme parks because people touch everything, but you guys don't. So, it's a matter of opinions.
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« Reply #1618 on: August 10, 2020, 09:34:03 PM »

Brother E: Fine, we'll agree to disagree. I and many other people who go to church believe that it's the same or worse in stores and theme parks because people touch everything, but you guys don't. So, it's a matter of opinions.
Most stores (About all Walmarts too, as far as I know) throw out food/groceries that are caught being touched on like camera, and most stores are not allowing you to return items you purchase out of fear of potentially having the virus contaminating the product. Stores really are doing their best to make sure you aren't infected, and although the process may not be 100% perfect, they're taking a lot more steps to preventing spread through their shops, compared to churches where many places of worship aren't even suggesting mask to be worn.

Considering your stance, I really do hope you don't catch the virus and I wish you safety, because it may be too late by the time you realize your small use of precautions taken to handle the virus were of poor judgement. Hmm
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« Reply #1619 on: August 10, 2020, 09:43:32 PM »

Most stores (About all Walmarts too, as far as I know) throw out food/groceries that are caught being touched on like camera, and most stores are not allowing you to return items you purchase out of fear of potentially having the virus contaminating the product. Stores really are doing their best to make sure you aren't infected, and although the process may not be 100% perfect, they're taking a lot more steps to preventing spread through their shops, compared to churches where many places of worship aren't even suggesting mask to be worn.

Considering your stance, I really do hope you don't catch the virus and I wish you safety, because it may be too late by the time you realize your small use of precautions taken to handle the virus were of poor judgement. Hmm
Brother E: Our older sister already got Covid last week, but it's all over now.  Well, that's  what the doctors said, but she was just sore and tired and didn't have Covid symptoms. Still her work ordered her to get tested. She feels perfect now. None of were positive, even though there is 8 in our house.  But we still go out and about without masks even though she "supposedly" was positive.
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